NUTS Big Battles vehicle questions

[dylanjones]

Vehicles operate by platoons in NUTS BB.

1.  If my tank platoon moves on the board and straight into sight  of several enemy tank platoons or anti-tank guns do we roll off as per the "multiple in sights" rule on page 9?  With each enemy tank platoon or anti-tank gun in sight rolling one set of dice?

2.  Assuming the answer to (1) is "yes", then assume that one of the enemy units wins the multiple in sight.  Presumably all that enemy platoon's tanks get to fire at me?

3.  Do they get to pick amongst the vehicles of my platoon which they're going to fire at?  Obviously, per page 18, they need to declare their targets before rolling any dice.

4.  If they hit one of my tanks, but fail to penetrate and force me to roll a Clank Test and I pass 1d6 and can return fire - do all the vehicles of my platoon return fire or only the vehicle hit?  And if instead of return fire we "carry on", does only the hit tank carry on or the whole platoon?

5.  If after all that firing is over I decide to activate another tank platoon and move it onto the table nearby then do we repeat the same process from (1) to (4) above?

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Vehicles operate by platoons in NUTS BB. Here goes.


1. If my tank platoon moves on the board and straight into sight of several enemy tank platoons or anti-tank guns do we roll off as per the "multiple in sights" rule on page 9? With each enemy tank platoon or anti-tank gun in sight rolling one set of dice? Correct.


2. Assuming the answer to (1) is "yes", then assume that one of the enemy units wins the multiple in sight. Presumably all that enemy platoon's tanks get to fire at me? Only the ones that can see a target. It is possible for part of a Platoon to be In Sight. So let's say first tank in 3 tank platoon finishes its move in sight but the other 2 are not. Only the In Sight tank can fire or be fired at.


3. Do they get to pick amongst the vehicles of my platoon which they're going to fire at? Obviously, per page 18, they need to declare their targets before rolling any dice. They match up one on  one until all have been targeted then they can double up.


4. If they hit one of my tanks, but fail to penetrate and force me to roll a Clank Test and I pass 1d6 and can return fire - do all the vehicles of my platoon return fire or only the vehicle hit? Only the one taking the test. And if instead of return fire we "carry on", does only the hit tank carry on or the whole platoon? Only the hit tank.


5. If after all that firing is over I decide to activate another tank platoon and move it onto the table nearby then do we repeat the same process from (1) to (4) above? Correct. Hope this helps.

[dylanjones]

Thanks!

Just trying to understand Multiple In Sights in Big Battles specifically.

If there are multiple defenders who spot my in sight attacker, does only one defender win the In Sight?
Or is it every defender who equals or beats the total passed dice of the attacker?
Or is it everyone who beats someone gets to react against that someone?

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Sept 5, 2021 20:18:44 GMT dylanjones said:

Thanks!

Just trying to understand Multiple In Sights in Big Battles specifically.

If there are multiple defenders who spot my in sight attacker, does only one defender win the In Sight?
Or is it every defender who equals or beats the total passed dice of the attacker?
Or is it everyone who beats someone gets to react against that someone?

Here's how it goes.
My Platoon moves out into sight of two enemy Platoons- call them A and B.
We roll In Sight.
A guy beats me but I beat B
A fires first.
If I survive I fire.
If B survived it now fires. Hope this helps.

[dylanjones]

Do I fire at A or B?

And second, why do we have the clank test result allowing me to fire back if I (and B) get to fire back anyway in all circumstances?

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Sept 6, 2021 5:11:14 GMT dylanjones said:

Do I fire at A or B? You return fire if allowed in who fired at you.

And second, why do we have the clank test result allowing me to fire back if I (and B) get to fire back anyway in all circumstances?You active fire at one target of choice.

Example - I activate and move into sight. Two enemies. In Sight and A fires at me. I return fire  on Clank Test. Now I'm active, I choose to fire at A or B. You get one active fire and as many clank test return fires that you score.

[dylanjones]

We're going around in circles a bit here I fear. :-)

Going back to the original example. I am the Active Player. I move my tank platoon into sight of two enemy platoons (so that is my Action for this turn, I won't be able to Active Fire in this activation). We roll. Enemy platoon A beats me. Enemy platoon B loses to me.
No doubting that platoon A gets first shot.

First scenario: A fires and all its tanks miss completely. What can I do? What can B do?  (let's keep all the explanation of what can be done *within* this activation only)
Second scenario: A fires and one firer hits. The damage result is one of my tanks is destroyed. I pass the Crisis Test with a "Carry On" result. What can my other tank do, if anything? What can B do?
Third scenario: A fires and one firer hits. The damage result is one of my tanks takes a Clank Test. It passes 1d6 and can return fire. What can my other tank do? What can B do?
4th Scenario: A fires and one firer hits. The damage result is one of my tanks takes a Clank Test. It fails and can Carry On. What can I do? What can B do?

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Sept 6, 2021 19:03:45 GMT dylanjones said:

We're going around in circles a bit here I fear. :-) No worries. 

Going back to the original example. I am the Active Player. I move my tank platoon into sight of two enemy platoons (so that is my Action for this turn, I won't be able to Active Fire in this activation). We roll. Enemy platoon A beats me. Enemy platoon B loses to me.
No doubting that platoon A gets first shot. Correct.

First scenario: A fires and all its tanks miss completely. What can I do?  They miss. They are done. You go next. You can Active fire at whoever you can see - A or B. Page 10.
   What can B do?  Nothing until you have finished your action. (let's keep all the explanation of what can be done *within* this activation only) 
Second scenario: A fires and one firer hits. The damage result is one of my tanks is destroyed. I pass the Crisis Test with a "Carry On" result. What can my other tank do, if anything? Nothing as they were not involved.  If A is done then move, fire, you're active, your choice.   What can B do? Nothing until you are done.
Third scenario: A fires and one firer hits. The damage result is one of my tanks takes a Clank Test. It passes 1d6 and can return fire. What can my other tank do? Nothing as it was not involved. What can B do? Still nothing until you are done acting.
4th Scenario: A fires and one firer hits. The damage result is one of my tanks takes a Clank Test. It fails and can Carry On. What can I do? Nothing until all of A is done.  What can B do? Nothing until you are done. Hope this helps.

[dylanjones]

You seem to have got the wrong rulebook. In NUTS BB, active units can EITHER move OR fire. If they have moved, they can't fire in the same activation as an action.

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Sept 6, 2021 21:16:02 GMT dylanjones said:

You seem to have got the wrong rulebook. In NUTS BB, active units can EITHER move OR fire. If they have moved, they can't fire in the same activation as an action.

Ahh, dang it! Sorry. Nice catch. Yes, rules that came after 2016 were updated to the following. I would sub this one out. Again, sorry for the confusion. Thanks for pointing it out.

ACTIONS

When a vehicle is active it may voluntarily do one of the following actions.

• Move up to full distance.

• Stay in place, change the way it is facing or rotate the vehicle’s turret.

• Attempt to run down enemy vehicles, heavy weapons, infantry, or structures.

FIRING

In addition to the previous actions, vehicles can fire during the turn at the following times:

• Once when active, if loaded.

• Each time when called upon to return fire,  if loaded.

[dylanjones]

Thanks.

This is a big change to Big Battles. Is it only tanks that can do this move-and-fire action? Or infantry and tanks alike? (I note that this will make infantry even more vulnerable given the uber tanks in Big Battles - see my other thread on this forum regarding the vulnerability of infantry in cover, not to mention if they're in the open. Tanks now don't even have to halt before they can eviscerate any infantry in LOS)

What does "when loaded" mean? No such rule explaining this restriction exists in Big Battles, as it currently is written.

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Sept 7, 2021 19:15:24 GMT dylanjones said:

Thanks.

This is a big change to Big Battles. Is it only tanks that can do this move-and-fire action? Or infantry and tanks alike? Infantry and tanks. (I note that this will make infantry even more vulnerable given the uber tanks in Big Battles - see my other thread on this forum regarding the vulnerability of infantry in cover, not to mention if they're in the open. Tanks now don't even have to halt before they can eviscerate any infantry in LOS) Not true. If they lose the In Sight the tanks get fired on first. If the infantry are out of range and cannot fire at the tanks, then they should not be there, instead in an area with terrain  where the ranges are shortened. I have a tank commander friend who was in Iraq and said the same. They would crush infantry from long range, but had to be concerned if they were going into towns - which is why they sent in the infantry first.

What does "when loaded" mean? Not applicable, it's a download from NUTS where each tank has a complete crew - Tank Commander, Gunner, Loader, Driver, etc.  No such rule explaining this restriction exists in Big Battles, as it currently is written.

[dylanjones]

Yes, I understand the tactical principle.

But, in the real world of gaming you are often under instructions such as "hold that hill" or "hold that crossroads". The infantry does not have the luxury of hiding in the middle of a woods or at the back of a built-up-area.

Anyway, thanks to easyeight I have a solution in the form of his suggested house rule.

[Ed the Two Hour Wargames Guy]

Yep, that would work well. Thank you for your input.